Oh partner I understand why you did it but...

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XaviRonaldo
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:41 am

Oh partner I understand why you did it but...

Unread post by XaviRonaldo » Fri Sep 03, 2021 10:49 pm

Ahead 8-6 in S1 the (Card_J-H) was turned up and I held.

(Card_J-D) (Card_Q-H) (Card_9-H) (Card_A-C) and I forget the other card but it was a low spade.

Deciding to bag for the win with the intention of calling next should they pass my partner decides it's prudent to donate. The dealer had (Card_K-H) so there's a chance they pick up anyway for the euchre and the win. I know with us being on 8 it's a chance they pass but it was so frustrating. This was after earlier in the game my partner squandering a 2 point hand by not leading a second diamond to give me a chance to throw out my junk. Was a high rated player too. Much higher than me.



RedDuke
Posts: 472
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2018 2:22 am

Unread post by RedDuke » Fri Sep 10, 2021 1:25 am

It doesn't matter that much that your partner donated here. You actually still have a chance to make a point if you play this hand well.

You're in S1. Lead the Q-Trump. If S2 has the ace, he'll probably play it. That gives you all the advantage since it leaves the dealer with only the right. You still have a guarded left and that green ace so if your partner has anything at all that can take a trick, you've got a chance to get three.

As you correctly point out, the dealer probably would have picked up here with the right-king combo. I'd actually question his competence if he didn't. But you've got just as good a chance as making a point off of of your partner's donate as you do of euchring the dealer.

Yes, I can understand why you're upset about it at a score of 8-6. If this is a skilled partner and he knew you were also skilled, he'd know that your pass meant that you had a loner stopped (which you do - you've got one guaranteed and two very likely tricks in your hand... if the upcard was anything but the right, your hand is a possible loner). You've got the deal though and probably with 9-6 (if the score is anything but that, the dealer must have had something pretty killer and your partner saved your butt by not letting the dealer go alone).

XaviRonaldo
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:41 am

Unread post by XaviRonaldo » Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:31 am

RedDuke wrote:
Fri Sep 10, 2021 1:25 am
It doesn't matter that much that your partner donated here. You actually still have a chance to make a point if you play this hand well.

You're in S1. Lead the Q-Trump. If S2 has the ace, he'll probably play it. That gives you all the advantage since it leaves the dealer with only the right. You still have a guarded left and that green ace so if your partner has anything at all that can take a trick, you've got a chance to get three.

As you correctly point out, the dealer probably would have picked up here with the right-king combo. I'd actually question his competence if he didn't. But you've got just as good a chance as making a point off of of your partner's donate as you do of euchring the dealer.

Yes, I can understand why you're upset about it at a score of 8-6. If this is a skilled partner and he knew you were also skilled, he'd know that your pass meant that you had a loner stopped (which you do - you've got one guaranteed and two very likely tricks in your hand... if the upcard was anything but the right, your hand is a possible loner). You've got the deal though and probably with 9-6 (if the score is anything but that, the dealer must have had something pretty killer and your partner saved your butt by not letting the dealer go alone).
I did get the point. That was my point. We could've had a euchre for the win. I just felt it was worth the risk of being euchred in diamonds to potentially get a euchre for the win in hearts. IIRC we won the game but that is irrelevant.

icanplay
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2019 12:05 pm

Unread post by icanplay » Fri Sep 17, 2021 1:50 pm

first, ordering up here is not really donating. Second, if you can stop the loner, you don't donate. I agree, do NOT order here. there is a great chance that solid opponents would make trump, and you go for the set. If they don't make it you really do need to go next... If you call next, you are weak so I call it to block... After you call it lead the DJ and then your off ace and hope for the best...
I am pretty confident in my statement above. An interesting discussion might be if you pass and your opponents order/pickup the right... What do you lead from seat one??? I am not real sure what is the best practice, but I am sure some experienced players would disagree...

jspectre
Posts: 227
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:04 am

Unread post by jspectre » Fri Sep 17, 2021 7:41 pm

icanplay wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 1:50 pm
first, ordering up here is not really donating. Second, if you can stop the loner, you don't donate. I agree, do NOT order here. there is a great chance that solid opponents would make trump, and you go for the set. If they don't make it you really do need to go next... If you call next, you are weak so I call it to block... After you call it lead the DJ and then your off ace and hope for the best...
I am pretty confident in my statement above. An interesting discussion might be if you pass and your opponents order/pickup the right... What do you lead from seat one??? I am not real sure what is the best practice, but I am sure some experienced players would disagree...
Well, it isn't a donation if 1st calls it, but it certainly is when 3rd decided to overstep their bounds. I would also never call here with the lead, but at higher scores it gets more complicated. I would lead the middle trump here if the dealer picks up, I'm looking for my partner to have a sole K or A, and I want to deny his partner the chance of helping out with a trump.

XaviRonaldo
Posts: 67
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2018 11:41 am

Unread post by XaviRonaldo » Fri Sep 24, 2021 7:18 am

jspectre wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 7:41 pm
I would also never call here with the lead, but at higher scores it gets more complicated.
[/quote]

That's a good point

9-9 I'm definitely ordering up. Hearts is much better than diamonds even ordering up a J

9-8 that's a strong hand. You're dead in the water if dealer passes because you can't risk diamonds. I think you order up here too.

8-9 tough one. You absolutely have to win the hand but could get a euchre for the win. I honestly don't know what the correct play here is. I'm thinking order it up because it's no more likely your partner has diamonds than the opponent. Have to win this hand.

8-8 boy oh boy that's tough again. You want 2 points for a euchre but can't afford to call diamonds and there's a decent chance you're euchred in hearts too. But you have no defence to black. Think you gotta call here too.

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