How should I play these types of hands from 1st?

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jspectre
Posts: 227
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:04 am

How should I play these types of hands from 1st?

Unread post by jspectre » Wed Aug 25, 2021 6:00 pm

I'm talking about calling up a trump to the dealer when you have right+2 and no aces or doubleton off suits. Is a trump lead always mandatory in this spot or can I lead off? With no aces I run the risk of leading into my opponents after taking a trick with the right and then following it up with my off suit lead, who then may be able to lead trump back to me after the right is gone. However, leading my off suit first has its risks as well, I could end up getting my partner's ace trumped by a solo trump or I may allow the dealer to play off and create another void if their partner has the ace, and my partner has to follow.

I could also simply end up 2 tricks down if I have to follow both my off suit leads, and if the dealer gets the second trick, then I'm at risk of being over trumped by S2. I'm more comfortable just leading the right if I also have the ace, but if I have something like JQ9 should I maybe be leading low instead here? Would this depend on the trump that is ordered into the dealer's hand? For example if I led the Q out of that hand and I ordered the K up, I have the potential of losing to just the K if 2nd seat plays under and my P can't beat it, while if I ordered up the 10, then my Q would at least beat the 10 if the dealer had no other trump.

Recently I had JK9 and ordered up the ace. I didn't want to lose to just the ace so I led the right, taking my partner's left with it, and handing us a euchre after S2 had back to back aces and the dealer still held the boss ace. I suppose it's also worth asking if I should bag this hand and try to call next if I have left+1, but I have to believe that the odds of my partner having the other bower is significantly decreased when I was holding 3 trump in the turned down suit, meaning that even if my opponents held the left (now right bower in next) they may well not have been able to make a call in the original suit.



irishwolf
Posts: 1201
Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:33 pm

Unread post by irishwolf » Wed Aug 25, 2021 9:26 pm

I have more success, fewer euchres leading off suit here to give my partner two bites at the apple with an Ace. Or if the dealer or his partner has the ace and leads the same suit, your partner can get into the action with that one trump. You have to also figure that your partner will have just one trump most of the time.

However, if you really want the best strategy, you can do the work and deal out those hands and statistically test it (played 3 ways one and one is passing) as has been discussed many times on this site. Maybe I should have added a 4th way with this type of hand, leading your lowest trump card. I will estimate that getting euchred is 23 to 28% so it does have a + EV to order up the dealer.

IRISHWOLF

jspectre
Posts: 227
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:04 am

Unread post by jspectre » Fri Aug 27, 2021 1:18 am

Irish, I believe you are correct. I don't think a trump lead is correct here at all, even minimal testing shows that to be true. I'm not sure when I started only leading trump in this spot, because it's not something I used to do. Instead, leading an off suit gives me a chance to see how the field plays out, and then I can react accordingly. On hands where a trump lead would have still scored a point, it's very likely that not leading trump can also achieve a favorable outcome.

Tbolt65
Posts: 786
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:14 pm
Location: Las Vegas

Unread post by Tbolt65 » Fri Sep 03, 2021 7:30 pm

Yeah don't lead trump.

Tbolt65
Edward

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