4-9 Friday Night Euchre Hand #1

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Tbolt65
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4-9 Friday Night Euchre Hand #1

Unread post by Tbolt65 » Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:16 pm

Score is 7-6 with East/West in the lead. The Deal is on the West position. it get's passed all the way around not once but twice. Comments?


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Tbolt65
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irishwolf
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Unread post by irishwolf » Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:58 pm

Why is eldest not making Diamonds. You deserve what you got. LOL

RedDuke
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Unread post by RedDuke » Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:12 pm

irishwolf wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:58 pm
Why is eldest not making Diamonds. You deserve what you got. LOL
That one's debatable.

Eldest has two tricks in diamonds but might struggle to get three tricks. He'd have to cross the river here with a somewhat weak hand.

I would have called spades as eldest, honestly. There's a better chance your partner can help and maybe that diamond ace will walk.

Tbolt65
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Unread post by Tbolt65 » Fri Apr 09, 2021 11:48 pm

On inspection of this hand to me. Dealer has to turn down in Round 1 and they do. For round 1 I'm in agreement with how all positions played. Round 2 However get's interesting. In round 2, seat 1 has stoppers and potential euchre's in all suits. Unless 9-9 or 8-9. I don't fault really at all Seat 1's passing in the Second round. Seat 2 round two Has a Next call or reverse Next call in diamonds. I wouldn't fault a call in either of them. They are a little stronger on their own with the spades call and boss king of clubs and having a void. But seat 2 passes here as well. Seat 2 probably shouldn't have passed here. Now onto seat 3. Seat three has reverse next stopped but does not have Next stopped. They have to figure their partner passed with something. I can see a call or pass here. Personally if I know my partners I will be more aggressive, even If I'm unsure of my partner I'm going to be calling something here(that's just how I am). Seat three must of figured their partner was either weak or got everything covered so they passed. Seat 4, is Stuck. They have to call something. Since their partner in Seat 2 didnt call anything and didn't call reverse next. He has to expect his partner is weak or perhaps have everything covered. So with that in mind the Dealer plays correctly and calls spades, with two spades, a void and has an Off A-Qhearts. They go on to eek out a point.


Tbolt65
Edward

Wes (aka the legend)
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Unread post by Wes (aka the legend) » Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:53 am

Tbolt65 wrote:
Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:16 pm
Score is 7-6 with East/West in the lead. The Deal is on the West position. it get's passed all the way around not once but twice. Comments?
First Rd:

S1: standard pass.

S2: This is very close to me. S2 may have a +EV call with L+K with an Ace upcard when he only blocks 1 out of 3 2nd rnd suits. I would need hard data to be convinced this is a pass. This is certainly a spot I will test down the road.

S3: Standard pass.

S4: This is another very close spot. Should the dealer pick up and have 2 trump + a doubleton green ace given that he blocks no 2nd rd suits? I suspect yes but I really don't know. Another factor here is if the dealer passes he does have 2 trump + an off ace vs a Next call. That certainly will slow down a lot of Next calls and contribute to euchring some and S1 is very aggressive and tends to call Next. EVEN IF it is generally correct to pick up with 2 low trump + an off ace when one blocks no suits, this spot could easily be an exception becuz the dealer does have help vs a Next call. This is another spot I will test down the road.

2nd Rd:

S1: Super standard pass. Calling anything here would be very bad, level zero play. Any call S1 makes would be a marginal call. Never call marginal when one has a pretty strong euchre hand if they pass.

S2: Blocking only 1 out of 3 remaining suits, S2 cannot pass here. S2 can either call reverse Next with 2 trump + a boss KC or jump the fence and call spades with R+1+a boss KC. When it's close go with Hoyle, but I don't think it's that close. I think spades is the clear superior call so that's what S2 needs to do in my estimation.

S3: Standard pass. Jumping the fence and calling hearts with just R+1+0 with no voids when one blocks reverse Next would be bad play by S3. S3's minimum jumping the fence hand in this spot should be R+1+A or L+1+2A. After all it's not S3's job to call super thin for defensive purposes. That's S1's job. S3 should just play level zero euchre here, I.E. just play his hand. Now if S3 had a P he didn't trust, then he'd have to open up his range more and include defensive calls, but that's not the case here. And even in the scenario when S3's P is an amateur I'd still pass this hand unless my team was up 9-7 or better. Calling hearts in this spot is just not a good call.

S4: Standard spade call here. Not just due to the inherent strength of S4's hand, but also for other bonus hand reading reasons: Since S1 is a strong player his 2nd Rd pass = he has reverse Next blocked but not necessarily Next blocked. S2's pass should signal only 3 possible interpretations:

1) He has all suits blocked
2) He has Next blocked but not enough to call reverse Next
3) He has nothing but still too weak to call reverse Next

Since S3 should be playing level zero here his pass doesn't really say that much about his range hand reading-wise other than we know he doesn't have enough to call in any suit.

Based on the above hand reading, in the long run in this spot spades will be the weakest suit in S1-S3's range and also the best suit in S2's range. So the dealers spade call is a good call for multiple reasons.

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