OE games 2-22 Dbl lead trump back to partner

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Dlan
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OE games 2-22 Dbl lead trump back to partner

Unread post by Dlan » Wed Feb 24, 2021 11:22 am




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LeftyK
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Unread post by LeftyK » Wed Feb 24, 2021 8:11 pm

yeah, never , ever, ever lead back on 2nd round. period !... see the results. next is called for s3. In fact, if s3 leads their doubleton, it wins both times as there are ZERO clubs out there. bad form s3 all the way around.

irishwolf
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Unread post by irishwolf » Thu Feb 25, 2021 11:08 am

Lefty stated, "yeah, never , ever, ever lead back on 2nd round. period !... see the results. next is called for s3."

I agree not warranted in the hand above as S3 has no off suit aces.

Is that really true as EVER NEVER?

I doubt that statement. In Euchre, I say be very careful of saying, NEVER EVER . . . without analysis!

For example, Diamonds was turned down and S3 has three trumps with AD doubleton and you want to pick up that unknown trump from opponents - JUSTIFIED TO LEAD a 2nd TRUMP! You will get a Sweep.

Even if S3 had AD AS/AC it would be better to lead a 2nd time.

~Irishwolf

Tbolt65
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Unread post by Tbolt65 » Thu Feb 25, 2021 4:53 pm

I agree with Irishwolf. Never say never. There are going to be times where one must recognize situations to double lead back trump to your partner and against your opponents. Same thing goes for double lead back in a suit.


Tbolt65
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Dlan
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Unread post by Dlan » Fri Feb 26, 2021 1:29 pm

Yes, never say never when it comes to euchre hands. On rare occasions, almost anything could show up. But, as a general rule, double leading trump increases the likelihood of a euchre.

Wes (aka the legend)
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Unread post by Wes (aka the legend) » Wed Mar 03, 2021 2:53 am

Good example Irishwolf.

Other spots to double lead back are anytime S3 has a viable path to 1 pt and he's playing with an expert in S1. For example, the score is 0-0, and the dealer who is a strong player turns down the (Card_9-C)

Our expert S1 calls next and leads the (Card_10-S)

S2 follows suit with the (Card_Q-S)

And S3 has this hand:

(Card_A-S) (Card_J-S) (Card_A-D) (Card_Q-D) (Card_9-H)

S3 should play the AS on the first lead knowing a strong dealer can never have an unguarded Left in this spot. Then S3 should swing back with the Right on 2nd street, and then play his AD on 3rd street. The idea is, S1 is an expert, which means his Next range is gonna be very wide in this spot. That one trump lead may be all the trump S1 has. So when S3 sees a pathway to score a point he needs to take it. Yes sometimes this line will prevent his team from getting 2 points, but it's the best line to take given an expert S1's overall wide range.

Here's a way more obvious example:

The dealer turns down the (Card_9-C)

S1, an expert calls Next and lead the (Card_J-C)

S2 follows suit with the (Card_Q-S)

S3 has (Card_A-S) (Card_J-S) (Card_A-H) (Card_J-H) (Card_10-D)

Notice when S1 leads the Left S3 can immediately deduce that's the only trump S1 can have. S3 holds the AS and the JS, if S1 had the 9s-Ks, he would lead the lower card. Therefore the Left is all S1 can have. Knowing this, S3 should play over the Left with his Right on the first lead, then lead the AS on 2nd street followed by his AH.

Same idea as above applies if an expert S1 calls next and leads the (Card_10-S)

and S3 has a hand like this:

(Card_J-C) (Card_J-S) (Card_A-D) (Card_10-D) (Card_9-H)

Take the first trick with a bower, lead back the other bower, and play the AD. The exception being if S2-S4 show void in trump on the first lead then obviously S3 should not lead back trump on 2nd street. Not so obvious, if S2 and S4 plays the two other highest trump on first street, say S2 plays the KS and S4 plays the AS, S3 should gamble and hope S2-S4 are now out of trump. Yes it's logically possible for S2 or S4 to still have the (Card_Q-S) but I think the gamble is worth it. S3 should instead be thinking about playing for 2 now and lead the AD on 2nd street.

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