Very Interesting Hand

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RedDuke
Posts: 444
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2018 2:22 am

Very Interesting Hand

Unread post by RedDuke » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:48 am

I'm in third seat with

(Card_J-H) (Card_A-D) (Card_10-D) (Card_9-H) (Card_9-C)

Upcard is (Card_K-D) .

Everybody passed, which may have been a mistake on my part, but the dealer picked up. My partner in first promptly leads the right.

My jaw hit the floor when I saw that. We had the guy euchred!

This was the first hand in the game so the score was 0-0.

Would you have called here? Third seat is a very hard spot to make a point from and I've actually been frequently euchred with far better hands than this. But at the same time three trump including the left+ace is tempting. I obviously don't have to worry about a diamonds loner. The guarded left+ace+1 will stop anything he's got. Those two off-nines are really weak though. If dealer has the right I could be in trouble if my partner is totally void in diamonds.

Would you have passed here at a score of 0-0 from third seat hoping to maybe euchre the dealer if he picked up and betting on your partner to call next? You've got a reasonable chance to assist your partner in next too with that jack+9 and the ace.

For those wondering, the dealer called with King+Queen and three off aces. His partner had the nine so my partner was just holding the right.



WolfHills
Posts: 12
Joined: Sun Jun 09, 2019 5:26 pm
Location: Abingdon VA

Unread post by WolfHills » Wed Jan 15, 2020 7:01 am

0-0 I am passing, plus if you have a good partner next might be called. I just have been euchred to many times with a similar hand.

irishwolf
Posts: 816
Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:33 pm

Unread post by irishwolf » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:56 am

What's not so good is your partner leading the Right to the dealer on defense.

Tbolt65
Posts: 598
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:14 pm
Location: Las Vegas

Unread post by Tbolt65 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 2:15 pm

I'm passing here. I have next covered if my partner goes next. I have a decent euchre hand if dealer picks up. If turned downed sometimes my partner may have a black loner. So At 0-0. There is really no incentive to order here from 3rd seat to the dealer.


Tbolt65
Edward

Wes (aka the legend)
Posts: 1301
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:03 pm

Unread post by Wes (aka the legend) » Wed Jan 15, 2020 6:01 pm

RedDuke wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:48 am
I'm in third seat with

(Card_J-H) (Card_A-D) (Card_10-D) (Card_9-H) (Card_9-C)

Upcard is (Card_K-D) .

This was the first hand in the game so the score was 0-0.

Would you have called here?
No, I bag here all day. The only score that I'm for sure calling at is 9-9. And I would call if up 9-X where X = 7 or below if I can't trust my partner in the 2nd round.

Wes (aka the legend)
Posts: 1301
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:03 pm

Unread post by Wes (aka the legend) » Wed Jan 15, 2020 6:01 pm

irishwolf wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:56 am
What's not so good is your partner leading the Right to the dealer on defense.
Yep, there's no way that was a good lead in this spot.

Richardb02
Posts: 633
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:57 pm
Location: Florida

Unread post by Richardb02 » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:28 pm

RedDuke wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:48 am
I'm in third seat with

(Card_J-H) (Card_A-D) (Card_10-D) (Card_9-H) (Card_9-C)

Upcard is (Card_K-D) .

Would you have passed here at a score of 0-0 from third seat hoping to maybe euchre the dealer if he picked up and betting on your partner to call next? You've got a reasonable chance to assist your partner in next too with that jack+9 and the ace.
Let's apply BPS:
0.75 Left
0.50 Right
0.25 Td
0.25 1Spade Void
0.50 3 Trump
-.25 Value of min Up Card (0.25) - Value of Kd (0.50)
2.00 vs. 2.75 min. points, so Pass empatically
____Note, Advanced BPS, would see strength in Next and adjust the hand value by:
-.50
1.50 vs. 2.75 minimum, Pass even more emphatically, success in Next's probability is higher!

irishwolf
Posts: 816
Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:33 pm

Unread post by irishwolf » Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:59 pm

How about pass at any score?

Wes (aka the legend)
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2018 3:03 pm

Unread post by Wes (aka the legend) » Thu Jan 16, 2020 6:22 pm

irishwolf wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:59 pm
How about pass at any score?
I suspect you would agree with the idea of trying to close out up 9-X if X = 7 or below and we can't trust our partner in the 2nd round. So the argument you're getting at is should I pass this at 9-9, assuming ofc that our partner is competent enough not to pass at 9-9.

Again, since we gain nothing from an enemy euchre at 9-9, this decision comes down to whether my team is more likely to have a better hand in the 2nd round than the one we have in the first.

Looking at this hand more closely:

(Card_J-H) (Card_A-D) (Card_10-D) (Card_9-H) (Card_9-C)

If my partner called Next in the 2nd round our team WOULD have a stronger hand than me ordering diamonds in the first round--giving the enemy a trump + a void from the toughest seat in the game. And knowing our partner should veer towards calling Next at 9-9 one could argue, persuasively, that we are probably better off passing on this diamonds call. I can't argue against that. With a good partner, it's probably correct.

Richardb02
Posts: 633
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2018 8:57 pm
Location: Florida

Unread post by Richardb02 » Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:04 pm

irishwolf wrote:
Wed Jan 15, 2020 10:59 pm
How about pass at any score?
IrishWolf, if you are asking me, “pass at any score?” I would say, let’s look at the BPS. The maximum add for score differential is 0.50. So the answer is yes. The 0.50 differential does not overcome the other factors.

irishwolf
Posts: 816
Joined: Tue Apr 24, 2018 9:33 pm

Unread post by irishwolf » Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:52 pm

Yes, I agree with this statement: "I suspect you would agree with the idea of trying to close out up 9-X if X = 7 or below and we can't trust our partner in the 2nd round. So the argument you're getting at is should I pass this at 9-9, assuming ofc that our partner is competent enough not to pass at 9-9.

Again, since we gain nothing from an enemy euchre at 9-9, this decision comes down to whether my team is more likely to have a better hand in the 2nd round than the one we have in the first..."

Just give me a trump or Ace lead!

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