Holding right and left bowers......only!

[daktsk]

I've been getting a lot of hands like this lately......



You have both bowers, but the rest is junk. Now, if you believe in the, (my), first rule of euchre...... "Depend on your partner for one", naming hearts or diamonds should get you a point. However, I have, and have seen other people, get euchred a lot trying this. I've noticed that as a general rule, sometime during the playing of the hand, you have the chance to throw off, losing a trick, (while you still have both bowers), rather than using one to take said trick. It seems to me that if I use one bower, I get euchred. If I let them take it, I make my point. Anyone have any suggestions on how to play a hand only having the bowers?

[Richardb02]

Before I look at my hand, I evaluate my Seat.
From Seat 1 & 3, Round 1, I would pass.
Ordering from Seat 2 is good. Picking from Seat 4 is strong.
If it it now Round 2, you have to look at Next and Reverse Next.
Seat 1, calling Next, is strong.
Seat 1, calling Reverse Next is an edge call (borderline).
Seat 2, calling Reverse Next is strong.
Seat 2, calling Next is ok.
Seat 3 would be a pass.
Seat 4 would be a call, Reverse Next is stronger than Next.
You can see more details in my post, Bidding Point System (BPS)- Basic.

[RedDuke]

I agree with Richard. If I'm in Seat 1 or Seat 3, I'll pass this hand. From Seat 1, if the hand is a point maker then it doesn't matter what side calls as you have first lead. If everybody passes, then you actually have a bit better odds calling next in the second round (which you should do). Seat 3 needs to have a seriously killer hand to call at any time and two bowers with no other trump or supporting aces isn't strong enough to call in either round. If you were to change the ten of spades to the ace though, I'd probably call.

Seat 2 should order up his partner. Usually I don't like to do this if I don't have at least three trump but if you're holding both bowers, it's pretty unlikely that you're stepping on your partner's lone call. If you're dealer, you should pick up here as well because you get a third trump and can discard the 10, giving yourself a 3-trump 2-suited hand. I'd actually pick up and go alone here as the dealer.

So, in conclusion:
Seat 1 - Pass in round 1, Call in round 2
Seat 2 - Call in either round
Seat 3 - Pass in both rounds
Seat 4 - Pick up and go alone in first round, call in second round

[Richardb02]

Here is a related and interesting hand:
Up Card Score 5-6 Players average & equal
Your Seat 2 hand:

Order up or call?
You only have the Right and the Left, the subject of this post.
But a key idea in Euchre (and every endeavor) is to keep increasing your understanding.
What would you do and why?

[Wes (aka the legend)]

I've been getting a lot of hands like this lately......



You have both bowers, but the rest is junk. Now, if you believe in the, (my), first rule of euchre...... "Depend on your partner for one", naming hearts or diamonds should get you a point.

Keep in mind that most euchre adages like "depend on your partner for one" were meant for beginners, specifically to guide them on their calls. Ideally you wanna break free from all euchre "rules of thumb" becuz altho they work very well for beginners, they will ultimately hold you back from ever becoming a strong player. For example there are many instances where you should call hoping your partner can get two, sometimes even 3! Euchre is a very complex game, or at least way more complex then most people give it credit for.

However, I have, and have seen other people, get euchred a lot trying this. I've noticed that as a general rule, sometime during the playing of the hand, you have the chance to throw off, losing a trick, (while you still have both bowers), rather than using one to take said trick. It seems to me that if I use one bower, I get euchred. If I let them take it, I make my point. Anyone have any suggestions on how to play a hand only having the bowers?

It sounds like you got the right idea. When you have two bowers and nothing else, give your partner every opportunity to get a trick.

[Wes (aka the legend)]

Before I look at my hand, I evaluate my Seat.
From Seat 1 & 3, Round 1, I would pass.

I agree.

Ordering from Seat 2 is good. Picking from Seat 4 is strong.

I think the hand is stronger from seat 2 becuz your team is guaranteed to have 3 trump. Not the case when you order from the dealer spot. Not closing the action is not a problem either with this hand from seat 2 becuz your plan should be to throw off on any non-green ace lead hoping your partner (who got to create a void) takes a trick, and when you do trump in you can't get overtrumped. And I would also never call this hand "strong" from the dealer spot. I don't think 2 bowers and nothing else can ever be qualified as strong, but that's just semantics. No matter what, we all agree it's a must call from the 2 spot or the 4.

If it it now Round 2, you have to look at Next and Reverse Next.
Seat 1, calling Next, is strong.
Seat 1, calling Reverse Next is an edge call (borderline).

I agree that you gotta "cross the river" with this holding. Giving seat 2 a chance to pull off a loner sweep in any suit or even a 2 point call would be tragic when you hold 2 bowers

Seat 2, calling Reverse Next is strong.
Seat 2, calling Next is ok.

Yep, call both.

Seat 3 would be a pass.

This is where I almost spit out my proverbial coffee and vehemently disagree. You have 2 guaranteed tricks. Even if your partner has no trump and just an off ace, you guys can easily score a point. With 2 bowers and nothing else going for your hand, you gotta call this. Never give the dealer a shot at a 2-4 point play with this strong of a holding (I don't think this holding is inherently strong, but strong enough that you cannot risk a pass).

SSeat 4 would be a call, Reverse Next is stronger than Next.
You can see more details in my post, Bidding Point System (BPS)- Basic.

Yep. Call.

[RedDuke]

Here is a related and interesting hand:
Up Card Score 5-6 Players average & equal
Your Seat 2 hand:

Order up or call?
You only have the Right and the Left, the subject of this post.
But a key idea in Euchre (and every endeavor) is to keep increasing your understanding.
What would you do and why?

Pass from second seat. If dealer picks up then you have a great helper hand. If he doesn't and first seat calls next then you've got one heck of a surprise for him. You've even got a guaranteed trick in both reverse next suits if everybody passes and first seat tries to cross the river (unlikely with you having a red jack though).

[JcobDi]

Here is a related and interesting hand:
Up Card Score 5-6 Players average & equal
Your Seat 2 hand:

Order up or call?
You only have the Right and the Left, the subject of this post.
But a key idea in Euchre (and every endeavor) is to keep increasing your understanding.
What would you do and why?

If I'm dealing I'll pick this hand up, otherwise I'm passing. If someone else calls, I'll need my partner to get one, we euchre and +2 to the scoreboard. If my partner picks up, +1 for sure because they're confident enough to pick it up on their own with a higher chance of +2. The opponent only has the chance for +1 because that hand has a definite 1 trick regardless of suit if played correctly (diamonds not 100% guaranteed based on play). If it comes back to me after the dealer turns down the card, I'm calling spades for a high chance of +1.

Therefore,
BCS: Seat 1/3 picks up and we euchre, +2 or dealer picks up and we take all 5, +2.
Next: Dealer picks up or I call after it's turned down, +1 if we get 3-4 / 5 tricks.
Opponents BCS: +2 or +4 through bad play, +1 if play is decent on diamonds.
WCS: We still get euchred (very unlucky + bad play).

[Richardb02]

JcobDi, you are right from S4 (Dealer). However, that wasn't what the post described. The post stated that you were S2. Wes presented a strong case for calling from S2 in this scenario. In a nutshell, your team has at least 3 trump, Partner (S4, Dealer) has a void. RedDuke disagreed but that was based on additional analysis because the hand included a green Jack. I should have done a better job on my sample hand; the green jack created an unintended possibility.