MUST the dealer order up in these situations?

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NickOfTime
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon May 23, 2022 11:59 pm

MUST the dealer order up in these situations?

Unread post by NickOfTime » Wed Jul 19, 2023 4:01 pm

I have three questions.

Situation: It’s a 10 point game. Your partner is dealer. Your opponents have 9 points. It’s the first round of bidding. (The dealer’s team has any point value.)

Underlying Premise: When the other team has 9 points, your team is dealing, it’s the first round of bidding… the dealer MUST order up the upcard to himself, regardless of whether or not he thinks he can even take 1 trick. You cannot allow the other team to name trump in the second round of bidding, as doing so will most likely result in them winning. 2nd seat passes in each of these examples/questions, as he does not want to risk stopping a possible lone call by his partner.

*First Question*: 1st - 3rd seat pass on the upcard. Is it considered mandatory for the dealer to order up the upcard to himself? (even if he doesn’t think he can take any tricks?)

*Second Question*:
Is it acceptable for 2nd seat to pass on the upcard, if he does not have a lone call?

*Third Question*:
Is it acceptable for 2nd seat to pass on the upcard, even if he thinks he can take 2 or 3 tricks?

Bottom line: 2nd seat is depending upon his partner, the dealer, to order up… no matter what cards the dealer holds.



Tbolt65
Posts: 825
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:14 pm
Location: Las Vegas

Unread post by Tbolt65 » Sun Jul 23, 2023 2:05 am

NickOfTime wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2023 4:01 pm
I have three questions.

Situation: It’s a 10 point game. Your partner is dealer. Your opponents have 9 points. It’s the first round of bidding. (The dealer’s team has any point value.)

Underlying Premise: When the other team has 9 points, your team is dealing, it’s the first round of bidding… the dealer MUST order up the upcard to himself, regardless of whether or not he thinks he can even take 1 trick. You cannot allow the other team to name trump in the second round of bidding, as doing so will most likely result in them winning. 2nd seat passes in each of these examples/questions, as he does not want to risk stopping a possible lone call by his partner.

*First Question*: 1st - 3rd seat pass on the upcard. Is it considered mandatory for the dealer to order up the upcard to himself? (even if he doesn’t think he can take any tricks?)

Generally with the opponents having 9. You don't want them to call. Granted Your partner is passing hands so you can go up and play a possible loner to close the game out but in most other situations that seat 2 pass should be an order. If no order from seat two When having 5 or lower or even having 8. Is telling you they are very weak. So as dealer you have to look at the score and the situation. Sometimes you just have to pass for your best shot but usually you will be calling something but Don't call with 1 or none, because unless your on 6 or 7 you can rest assured your partner has zero or little help at best and they may not factoring in at all either


*Second Question*:
Is it acceptable for 2nd seat to pass on the upcard, if he does not have a lone call?

Seat two should only be possibly passing at 6 or 7 to let you try to go alone at the dealer to win the game all other scores he should really be helping. If it gets back to seat 2 in round two. Seat 2 absolutely can not pass. He has to call something even if he has 1 trump.


*Third Question*:
Is it acceptable for 2nd seat to pass on the upcard, even if he thinks he can take 2 or 3 tricks?

No, that's Unacceptable. There is a real chance of getting two points if you got 3 sure tricks even if you have both bauers or lets say Right-Ace of trump Or say Right-X in trump with an Off ace. These should all be orders when opponents have 9 from seat two.

Bottom line: 2nd seat is depending upon his partner, the dealer, to order up… no matter what cards the dealer holds.

Tbolt65
Edward

jblowery
Posts: 184
Joined: Tue Dec 11, 2018 10:43 am

Unread post by jblowery » Tue Aug 01, 2023 1:18 pm

No way I agree w/ this premise. When the other team has 9 you should never pass in R2. However, in R1 you don't automatically pick. They are very different. Your minimum hand to pick up should be lower, for both S2 and S4. S1 and S3 will have a higher minimum hand to order.

If S2 doesn't order that means he/she had a very marginal hand. Why would I pick up if I don't have any other trump and I know my partner is also weak in that suite?

On the other hand, if you pass, then S1 is in a tough position without a slam dunk hand. He/she knows that they lose if they get euchered. Very good chance S1 passes in this situation.

Then S2 MUST call something.

Tbolt65
Posts: 825
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:14 pm
Location: Las Vegas

Unread post by Tbolt65 » Wed Aug 02, 2023 12:41 am

jblowery wrote:
Tue Aug 01, 2023 1:18 pm
No way I agree w/ this premise. When the other team has 9 you should never pass in R2. However, in R1 you don't automatically pick. They are very different. Your minimum hand to pick up should be lower, for both S2 and S4. S1 and S3 will have a higher minimum hand to order.

If S2 doesn't order that means he/she had a very marginal hand. Why would I pick up if I don't have any other trump and I know my partner is also weak in that suite?

On the other hand, if you pass, then S1 is in a tough position without a slam dunk hand. He/she knows that they lose if they get euchered. Very good chance S1 passes in this situation.

Then S2 MUST call something.

Did you mean R2(round 2) or S2(Seat 2)?

It all depends on the actual score as well. Certain scores you want to pass in to allow for loners or euchre's with strong euchring hands.

Tbolt65
Edward

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